SHAH ALAM: Ingwe Missile. The Army conducted the first firings of the Denel Ingwe missiles from the Gempita AFV30 ATGW armoured vehicles at the firing range at Kem Sirajuddin in Gemas today. Two Gempitas took part in the missile firings.
Only BTDM Online covered the exercise which also included the firings of three other variants of the Gempita, the AFV30, IFV25 and the RWS. A Gempita reconnaisance variant fitted with the Vingtaqs II target acquisition and surveillance system was also photographed at the exercise.
The Vingtaqs II surveillance system mast on the second Gempita. The antenna of the Squire radar dominates the mast.
I believed this was the first time the surveillance system of the reconnaissance variant has been photographed with the mast in the up position.
The Vingtaqs II optronic device without the radar antenna.
From Rheimentall.
The Vingtaqs II is a tripod- or mast-mounted long-range surveillance, observation and reconnaissance system developed by Simrad Optronics, now Rheinmetall Nordic, for armored vehicles. The Vingtaqs II accurately determines target coordinates at long distances from the vehicle forward observer position. A standalone system, the Vingtaqs II can be integrated at low cost into a wide variety of vehicles. The system also accommodates instrumentation for laser-designated targeting, enabling it to support forward air controller operations
The Gempita Vintaqs II system is also fitted with the Thales Squire ground surveillance radar for detection/tracking and classification of moving ground targets.
Lt Gen. Azizan looking at the firing display in a Gempita, likely the AFV30 ATGW variant.
The BTDM posting did not mentioned whether the two AFV30 ATGW were guided to their targets by the reconnaissance variant however. Army Western Field Commander Lt. Gen. Azizan Md Delin was on hand to witness the firings.
Lt Gen. Azizan being briefed on the Ingwe missile inside its firing canister.
It is also interesting to note that the two AFV30 ATGW were in a green camo instead of the Army’s standard digital camouflage. This may indicate that the two are factory fresh vehicles and have yet to be delivered to the Army.
The two green Gempita AFV30 ATGW on the firing line. The one on the right fitted with a red flag is the one fitted with a live round.
Industry sources told Malaysian Defence that Ingwe missiles were only delivered in early 2017 even though the AFv30 ATGW Gempita had been delivered to the two units operating them in 2016, 19th RMR and 1 KAD.
On the Way. The Ingwe missile on the way to the target.
The missiles were supposed to be delivered in late 2016 for acceptance firings but this was delayed to early 2017. It is likely that the firings today was part of the acceptance programme for Ingwes. I am not sure whether this was the first local firings of the Ingwes but it was the first time that the Army had publicised them openly.
19th RMR AFV30 ATGW Gempita
The missiles had been fired from the AFV30 ATGW as part of the Gempita test programme. These firings took place in Turkey and the Denel Overberg test range in South Africa. All of the missiles hit the targets in these test firings, I am told.
— Malaysian Defence
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View Comments (111)
I was under the impression that Squire and Vintaqs were separate variants.
"The BTDM posting did not mentioned whether the two AFV30 ATGW were guided to their targets by the reconnaissance variant however."
That's probably not a capability the Ingwes have. Pretty advanced technology you know.
BTW do we have any idea how many Gempita have been delivered? What variants have we not seen yet?
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Off topic,
http://www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sales/ukraine-javelin-missiles-and-command-launch-units
Ukraine will soon get Javelins it seems. Kind of shutting the barn door after the horse has bolted, but Russia's little green men are going to have to step more carefully now all the same.
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What I meant was that the target was selected by the recon vehicle. I think we have not seen six other variants, the combat engineer, recovery, NBC, signals, ambulance and mortar.
Marhalim,
You have posted a few times about the signals version before
https://www.malaysiandefence.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/ACVS.jpg
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Oh, yes, I must confused it with the command and control version, which also has a signals component.
BTW what is next for the army for RMK12 (2021-2025)?
- Would there be a gempita batch 2?
- Additional PT-91s?
- official start of condor remanufacturing program?
- new equipment for the para brigades?
- rolling out the NCO systems to the whole of the army, or selected brigades?
For RMK11 (2016-2020) as of now:
- AV8 gempita
- new satcom equipments
- additional software defined radios.
- AV4 Lipanbara
- Starstreak system
- additional RPG-7s
- additional AT-4s
- M109A5+ SPH
- GK-M1 weapon carriers and FFR
- new 5 ton MAN trucks
- 105mm LG-1
- major funding for special forces equipments
- anything else?
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Basically the plan is to have the same capabilities in the peninsula in Sabah and Sarawak. What this means remains unknown.
Not much is out there officially as the Army is in a flux as a change of leadership is coming by early next year. It may have something but the impression I got is that no one wants to make it official as it might changed anyhow.
At approximatel USD9 mil a piece, the AV8 with the Ingwe is quite expensive for an anti armour role compared to PT91M at around USD5 mil a piece.
It seems to be a better option to opt for more PT91M as an anti armour role, cost wise. But other factors should also be considered such as technological advancement as PT91M is at best mid 90's or early 2000 tech.
The plus point of PT91M apart from purchase cost is better armour protection compared to AV8.
Chua,
No doubt we'll next see separatist MBTs with APSs to counter Javelin. Given that more APSs are entering service, their prices will drop in the coming years. Remains to be seen what the counter will be against a APS however. The only one I can think of would be to saturate it but that will cost a lot as more missiles will be expended.
On Javelin personally I think it's a great missile. Compared to older gen stuff it's more compact and easier to lug around and is non wire guided with a top attack function. In this day and age why would anyone want a wire guided system and why try to defeat a target frontally [it best protected arc] when it can be hit on the roof. No doubt MBDA will soon be offering us MMP if they haven't already done so. At first glance it does look bulkier than Javelin though and I have no idea how it compares in cost.
- The Armour Directorate is still undecided on the question of follow on MBTs. Follow on PT-91s wouldn't make sense as they would need major upgrades to improve their SA and protection levels and the design really has reached the end of its growth potential. The PT-17 I suppose is a possibility but it would have to compete against stuff like Altay. The problem is we have to get a MBT with superior protection levels [amongst other things] to the PT-91 but if we get another design; the army will have 2 different MBTs to support and train crews on. Whatever we buy, ideally it will have a APS but funding will no doubt be the main issue here.
- I would like to see more attention paid to engineering units; whether its armoured bulldozers or more bridging. Converting some units into ''combat'' engineers - to operate alongside infantry units - would be ideal but I suppose asking too much at this juncture.
- UASs would be very useful; not just for operational level surveillance but also to arty units.
- Decent quantities of sights to equip the M-4s and support weapons in various battalions.
- It remains to be seen if GAPU intends to replace its GDFs with a new gun or will in the future only stick to missiles. Come to think of, the Giraffes are getting a bit old too.
Long shopping list but limited funds.
.... - ''rolling out the NCO systems to the whole of the army, or selected brigades?''
I would think that priority would be to first ''link'' the Army Field HQ and Joint Force HQ; followed by Divisions, Brigades, etc and of course GAPU and its early alerting systems/radar. Ideally, the
TRS-3Ds will be able to ''talk'' to the CONTROLMasters and ideally early warning will be able to be provided to Igla teams by means other than via radio. Similarly, if VERA detects a UAS it would be useful if the info was provided to HQ by means other than radio.
@ Azlan
"The problem is we have to get a MBT with superior protection levels [amongst other things] to the PT-91 but if we get another design; the army will have 2 different MBTs to support and train crews on."
If Malaysia finally chooses the Altay then it will have 2 different ammo 120mm and 125mm.
Btw it seems the Gempita AFV30 ATGW still are without any 360 degrees Commander Sight.
kamal - ''The plus point of PT91M apart from purchase cost is better armour protection compared to AV8.''
Yes but one's a MBT and one's a IFV.
Bear in mind that both will be used for the MBT killing role in different ways. The AV-8 is not intended to be used as an independent MBT killer [i.e. go looking for MBTs to kill] but always when operating as part of a combined arms unit and mainly to provide units with protection against MBTs.
Not only is the PT-91 better protected, it has better mobility when it comes to dealing with obstacles or in rough terrain. It also has a hunter killer capability which the AV-8 does not have. On protection; it's due to ERA. Without ERA in certain areas, the
PT-91 can be penetrated by 25/30mm.
kamal - ''But other factors should also be considered such as technological advancement as PT91M is at best mid 90’s or early 2000 tech.''
Like the M-1, Leopard, etc, the PT-91 is a design originating from the 1970's. It has a high spec fit out [till today it remains of the best equipped T-72 variants] but due to funding issues other things that could have been done were not done as part of the upgrades. The fact remains is that it has reached the end of its growth potential and that when it comes to protection and SA it falls behind other designs.