SHAH ALAM: It appears that the RMN had stood up the ASW Helicopter Nucleus Team to provide the overview and technical guidance for the procurement of the aircraft. The existence of the team was made public when it visited a Japanese ship and its resident helicopter, which docked at the Port Klang Cruise Terminal on March 5.
The release by RMN stated that the nucless team was invited to a Subject Matter Expert Exchange programme to take a closer look at the ASW Helicopter (SH-60J) operated by JS ARIAKE. Destroyers Ariake (DD-109) and JS Hamagiri (DD-155) berthed at the terminal on March 5.
Malaysian Defence was told that the nucleus team was stood up last year as the RMN geared up for the procurement of four ASW helicopters in RMK 13. Another four is likely to be procured in the next RMK or the next one. As with other nucleus teams, if the contract for the ASW helicopters is signed, some of them will become the project team personnel to oversee the manufacturing and delivery of the aircraft.
The likely candidates for the project are (in no particular order) the Lockheed Martin SH-60/70 Seahawk; Leonardo AW-159 Wildcat, Bell 412 MMH, Airbus EC-725 and the NFH-90 Caiman. Other helicopters may well be offered as well, I am told. RMN has been looking to procure ASW helicopters for the last two decades or so but as always other things got in the way.
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PELABUHAN KLANG, 5 Mac β Dua aset Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force (JMSDF) telah tiba ke Malaysia dalam rangka program lawatan operasi hari ini.
Aset terdiri daripada kapal jenis kelas pemusnah iaitu JS ARIAKE (DD109) dan JS HAMAGIRI (DD 155) tiba di Port Klang Cruise Terminal disambut dengan iringan pancaragam KD Pelandok. Turut hadir dalam majlis menerima ketibaan kapal adalah Pembantu Duta Besar Jepun di Malaysia, Minister Karimata Atsushi.
Dalam siri lawatan operasi kali ini, Pejabat Penasihat Pertahanan Jepun juga turut merangkakan program interaksi bersama warga TLDM termasuk aktiviti lawatan kapal yang melibatkan warga TLDM dari Markas Tentera Laut dan Pusat Hidrografi Nasional. Selain itu, Tim Nukleus Projek Helikopter ASW TLDM telah dijemput dalam program Subject Matter Expert Exchange untuk mengadakan lawatan ke kapal dan melihat dengan lebih dekat Helikopter ASW (SH-60J) yang dioperasikan oleh JS ARIAKE.
Lawatan ini melakar satu catatan sejarah yang akan menjadi satu lagi pemangkin kepada pengukuhan hubungan dua hala TLDM dan Tentera Laut Jepun pada masa hadapan.
Malaysian FPDA allies, Singapore and Australia also operate the Seahawk for ASW roles, which may provide further insights for the nucleus team. The US Navy the biggest user of the Seahawks may well also be in their future plans. The UK Navy which plans to bring a carrier to this region this year may also provide more reference for the nucleus team. The UK operates the Leonardo AW-101s in the utility, AEW and ASW variants.
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View Comments (53)
At one time we were all for the Wildcat but things have changed. AgustaWestland as it use to be called has less "pull" and support isn't cheap. Also, what it quoted to upgrade the Lynx was almost as high as buying new, according to the RMN.
Ultimately the LCS can have the best performing sonar in the world but it still takes a helo with the space and lift capacity for a pair of torps, dipping sonar, sonobuoys and fuel.
ASW is time extensive and at times the helo will have to fly quite a distance to get to where the contact is. It will have to spend time fixing and engaging the contact and to fly back.
Unless we intend to use a pair of Wildcats [one with a dipping sonar and one with a torp], not the most practical way of doing things, to deal with every contact, something other than Wildcat is needed if we are serious about ASW and intend on getting more than a minimal capability. The good news is that the hangar on the LCS has been enlarged/lengthened and can accommodate something larger than Wildcat.
Since we're on ASW am I correct in saying the Batch 2s will not have a sonar and a pair of triple torp tubes?
I wonder if thereβs a plan to fly the ASW helos off the LMS batch 2 too since they are not going to have sonar and light weight anti sub torpedo?
There is a plan but not stationed on them unless it is the only ship around the area.
Wildcat is a multirole platform like the f35. So obviously it's a jack of all trade master of none if one going to compared it to a dedicated platform.
But if we do procured the seahawk, we would need to procured either the Apache and viper as well Since the Seahawks can't do pew pew. Or we could just procured the wildcat and have it done both job. Not brilliantly off course. Nor do we need 2 wildcat to do a single job since Airbus had been promoting their vsr700 asw uav working on top of a belharra few months ago. Not sure if it's a prototype or someone had thrown money into it though
Another thing to consider is the are where we would perform the asw operations. Neither the LCS or our upcoming MPA has long leg so it's not like we are going to search for sub in the middle of the Pacific.
Politically I just don't see the current gov would find American products to be political correct just like all the previous gov did.
Not saying the Seahawks can't win. But I wouldn't hold my breath for it.
From the options available we can go on and ditch 2 of the contender; NH90 and Bell 412; one for being utter crap without excuse and the other for simply being inadequate of a platform we might as well go with navalized AW139
Hopefully we can get navalized Caracal for the ASW tasks as not only it's bigger, the AF already have decades of experience in operating them
The AW139 does not come with folded rotors, AFAIK.
@ azlan
STM turkiye corvette does not have any ASW capability
@ marhalim
AW139 dont have a hole in the floor for dipping sonar
The lowest cost option is to ask JMSDF for some of its SH-60J Seahawks. They have more than 80 of them retired, and now mostly has been replaced with newer SH-60K (even SH-60K is going to be replaced by SH-60L soon). SH-60J production is from 1991-2007.
Currently JMSDF have 12 SH-60Js and 75 SH-60Ks in active service as of March 2022
Another option is to have the GOWIND Frigate to operate with other smaller ships as part of multistatic sonar operations
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GV0j5meaAAAs0Or.jpg
LIMA is coming this year rite? So the team will have great opportunity to look at the choppers of various nation ships coming to visit.
"Lockheed Martin MH-60 Seahawk; Leonardo AW-159 Wildcat, Bell 412 EPX, Airbus EC-725 and the NFH-90 Caiman"
Of these, only the Seahawk, Caracal, & Wildcat are viable contenders. The Sea Huey is fixed skid gear and needs special trolley for onboarding, the NH90 is a problem no one wants with a 10ft pole. Of the 3, Seahawk is whats ideal but most expensive, Wildcat is most affordable but shortest leg yet its known as we using it too, EC725 is also known to us but in TUDM utility role, as for ASW it will not be cheapish either. A left field prospect is another Leo; AW101 Merlin.
Imho the most likely will be Wildcat simply because its the only option which we can afford. Ideally the ASW Caracal would be the best balanced option if Seahawks with Seahawk too expensive.
If fitted with a dipping sonar Wildcat will not be a "jack of all trades".
If we go get Seahawk it will have nothing to do with the likes of Apache and Viper. Anything more than us getting 155mm guns has to do with the need to get RCLs or NVGs. Have no idea what "pew pew" is and not really inferested in finding out.
ASW configured UASs are still in the early days and at present are mainly intended to supplement manned assets.
Also, a helo is only expected to fly X NM away from the ship and there might be times when the MPA is operating in tandem with the ship and the embarked ASW helo. There is also a difference between range and endurance.
Zaft - "Politically I just donβt see the current gov would find American products to be political correct just like all the previous gov did"
Anything is possible. From time to time we do buy American or stuff which contains a high proportion of American stuff, e.g. F/A-50s. BTW it's more "politically correct" or palatable compared to buying Chinese, especially after the air incident. You also might be aware or not, that at times it's not poliical correctness but the fact that certain stuff can only be acquired via FMS that puts us off getting American.
"can accommodate something larger than Wildcat."
Or a Wildcat with dipping sonar and a portable UAV dropping torp like an Amazon drone delivering your packages.
"Since the Seahawks canβt do pew pew"
Why do we need ASW choppers to do that?
"Not saying the Seahawks canβt win. But I wouldnβt hold my breath for it."
Mainly coz its far too expensive to afford, more than any other reasons.
The wildcat is part asw platform and part attack helo. Not particularly good at either compared to a dedicated platform but would allow the bean counter to crossed 2 requirements in one go.
Even if TDM eventually gets the greenlight to get a dedicated attack helo no other attack helo other than American can do both land and maritime strike. Thus getting the wildcat would mean if we were to procured an attack helo. The bean counter can cross maritime strike capable off the requirements and allow them to consider others cheaper non American attack helo.
Not to mention the gov also wouldn't have to deal with FMS while also getting "local participation" parts in and still get to curry favor with the voters whose dislike America (Be it because of Gaza or their anti china stands.) while also getting the economic of scale part of the DWP fulfill by standardizing all helo to AW platform. So while the Seahawks maybe a superior ASW platform operationally. There's other factors that would favor the wildcat considerably.
FA50 is a bit different because there's really no other alternatives that can do FLIT, interceptor, ground attack and BVR in one go. Buying anything other than FA50 would mean we would need more MRCA then the current 2 squadron proposed.